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chikoppi
Forum Full Member


Registered: 04/02/04
Posts: 1966
Location: N/A
 
Hitrecord.org
Tuesday, September 13 2016 @ 09:58 AM CDT

http://www.hitrecord.org

An interesting take on a collaborative creative projects community.

“Ya, that idea is dildos.” Skwisgaar Skwigelf
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awigze
Forum Full Member


Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 2307
Location: , The Republic of Texas
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Wednesday, September 14 2016 @ 04:03 PM CDT

interested.

Music is the master link in the chain of the tribes of mankind! -SloParts
and so it goes...
MikeRobinson
Forum Full Member


Registered: 08/29/11
Posts: 718
Location: Chattanooga, TN United States
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Monday, September 19 2016 @ 07:17 AM CDT

To me, the basic problem with all of these sites (and, there are many ...), is that they encourage you to presume that “there is no money in it.”   You are supposed to “contribute” hours of work and the product of your own expertise to a “collective” project, compensated only by the joy de vivre of participation itself.   Although, necessarily, the organization does promise to split “profits” (they have to ...), read the fine print and you will see that they are “net profits,” and they will be split among a fairly arbitrary number of outstretched hands.≠

In the world of commercial music, one thing, and only one thing, actually matters:   you must own The Copyright.   And, you (perhaps along with a small number of co-writers ...) must have uncontested title to it.   (Recall what happened recently concerning a certain chord progression, and Stairway to Heaven.)

“Keep your eye on that ball.”   The copyright owner receives a dis-proportionate share of the total revenue, and it is legal title to the song, itself, including a share of any and all derivative works made from it by anyone anywhere.

We receive several thousand dollars a month(!) from an obscure song recorded by a famous artist in the 1950’s, as that song and any derivative of it is played anywhere from Hamburg to Croatia.   (“BMI is Listening.”)   These are songwriter royalties.   We also receive about $100 every three years or so, when the money finally adds up to a large-enough amount for Schapiro-Bernstein to cut a check.   These are the “mechanicals” from a handful of others.   If there were “a hundred songwriters,” or people who could claim to be so, then all of it would be too diluted to be financially useful to anyone.
chikoppi
Forum Full Member


Registered: 04/02/04
Posts: 1966
Location: N/A
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Monday, September 19 2016 @ 09:13 AM CDT

Quote by: MikeRobinson
To me, the basic problem with all of these sites (and, there are many ...), is that they encourage you to presume that “there is no money in it.”



Eh...I think you should take a closer read of this site. It is specifically about for profit collaboration. Also, it isn't limited to music.

“Ya, that idea is dildos.” Skwisgaar Skwigelf
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MikeRobinson
Forum Full Member


Registered: 08/29/11
Posts: 718
Location: Chattanooga, TN United States
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Monday, September 19 2016 @ 01:12 PM CDT

I did “look closely,” and what most stood out to me with regard to music is that there would be a very muddled chain of ownership of the intellectual property.   In my mind, this model would be much better suited to collaborative works other than music, and yet the site is named hitrecord.

From an IP point of view, the song is the product, not any particular expression of it.   Ownership of the property must be clear, and the total set of owners, small.   BMI isn’t going to cut checks to a hundred people.   There’s going to be a few songwriters and one publisher, and that’s who they’re going to pay, and (presumably) hitrecord is then going to burst that piece of pie to its final destination after taking their slice off the top.
chikoppi
Forum Full Member


Registered: 04/02/04
Posts: 1966
Location: N/A
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Monday, September 19 2016 @ 02:53 PM CDT

You said, "they encourage you to presume there is no money in it." The premise of the site is that there is money in it and that in a collaborative work the share of ownership should be clear. This is why I found it interesting.

When contributing:
- The artist retains non-exclusive rights to what he/she creates
- If incorporated into a project, the artist earns a share based on the contribution
- There is a community arbitration process to determine profit share equity
- The site is granted non-exclusive rights to try and monetize your works

I don't think a working professional (musician, director, animator, etc.) or studio would use the site to publish major works. They would hire talent directly and retain the rights (I wouldn't use it as a platform to sell my professional design work). But for creative enthusiasts, there's a potential to earn from what you would otherwise do for free.

Maybe it isn't for you, and that's fine. But it is a novel approach to a community that acknowledges the potential profitability of collaborative works that are created and freely shared by members.

What does it mean that the Company may “monetize” RECords?

As more fully described in the Company Terms, it means that the Company may use any of your RECords (either alone or in combination with any other RECord(s) created by you or any other User) for monetary gain. After RECords are included in a Production, the Company will split the money it makes 50/50 with all of the Contributing Artists whose RECords are included in the particular Production.

What does it mean that the Company has the “non-exclusive right” to monetize RECords?

This means that the Company may monetize your RECords as described above and in the Company Terms, although you still own your RECords and have the right to monetize them on your own as well. However, you may only Post RECords to hitRECord that you have the right to Post as described above and further described in the Terms. For example, this means that you cannot Post to hitRECord any RECord to which you have granted a third-party distributor, such as Twentieth Century Fox or Universal, the exclusive right to monetize.

How is the Contributing Artists’ Profit Pool split up?

That’s a question that was especially hard to figure out. We tried to come up with a formula that would work every time, but in reality, every Production is unique. So this is how we do it. In connection with each Production, we Post on hitRECord a public proposal to Users explaining how we believe the Profits should be fairly split among Contributing Artists. We encourage Contributing Artists to engage in conversation and voice their opinions – we want to make sure every Contributing Artist is included and that the community agrees we are splitting the Profits fairly. After approximately two (2) weeks, we will make the final allocation decision, but our decision will be informed by and based upon community feedback from the Contributing Artists as described above.

“Ya, that idea is dildos.” Skwisgaar Skwigelf
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MikeRobinson
Forum Full Member


Registered: 08/29/11
Posts: 718
Location: Chattanooga, TN United States
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Monday, September 19 2016 @ 08:21 PM CDT

Basically, then, this amounts to “arguing over the mechanicals,” while the owner of the web-site walks away with the only real prize.
When contributing:
- The artist retains non-exclusive rights to what he/she creates
- If incorporated into a project, the artist earns a share based on the contribution
- There is a community arbitration process to determine profit share equity
- The site is granted non-exclusive rights to try to monetize your works
It is abundantly clear from the foregoing verbiage that “a project” is perceived to be “the thing that is being sold,” and that “what is being sold” is, indeed, “a thing.”   A download.   A vinyl disc.   A cassette tape.   An 8-track.   A discrete digital event.   A thing.

... A mechanical.

Wait three years and however-many-of-you get to split $100.00.   Woo hoo...

Nevermind:   in the paperwork that actually gets filed with the US Government, who is The Songwriter™?!

Nothing else matters.

“The law of the (international ...) land” says that there is one (or, a very few) songwriter(s), and the rights of this party are exclusive.   Led Zeppelin is entitled to royalties from anyone and everyone who publishes a cover of “Stairway to Heaven,” or anything that [BMI decides ...] is sufficiently similar to it, and “Led Zeppelin,” for these purposes, consists of a clearly-defined (small) handful of (very rich ...) people.

Likewise:   either you are “the Songwriter,” or you are a stage-hand someone who is engaged in trying to turn The Songwriter’s Property into a commercial venture.   “The Songwriter’s Share” is not open to question:   it is Fifty Percent.   The Songwriter need not bother himself or herself with petty squabbles among the technicians and musicians, who are after all fighting over the other half.

... -i-f the site actually manages to come up with any cash whatsoever, which, kindly notice, they never promise that they will actually manage to do.

... (therefore, why exactly are you wasting your time?)

I strongly suspect that, when the actual copyright registration is filed, “hitsong.com, inc.” will wind up as either the copyright-holder or at the very least as the publisher.   And this means that they get to scoop all of the sweet cream off the top of this churn-full of butter, and to continue to do so forever, while you squabble over pennies.

When they say, “monetize,” I very strongly suspect that they mean ... “mechanicals.”   Why don’t you ask Loretta Lynn what she thinks about that sort of bargain?

I quite frankly don’t give a damn “who played bass, fifty years ago,” on the songs that today we o-w-n ...
 
chikoppi
Forum Full Member


Registered: 04/02/04
Posts: 1966
Location: N/A
 
Re:Hitrecord.org
Monday, September 19 2016 @ 09:57 PM CDT

Then don't use it.

If you think your musical track is going to be a top ten hit a decade from now then don't post it and don't freely offer it up for collaborative use. Retain all the rights.

If, however, you feel like contributing a bit of work for open collaboration with no expectation of return (as frequently happens here), great! If someone else then does the legwork to sell that project for commercial use you'll see some money on the back end. If they don't, you won't.

It's not meant as a platform for professional musicians or as a replacement for a record label. It's not a platform for artists to publish songs or albums. If you want something like that then don't use it.

As I said, I likely wouldn't offer my design work on that site (because I'm a professional and I don't work for free...unless it's for charity). I might however contribute some musical pieces just for fun. I wouldn't care if someone else finds a commercial use for them. But if they did there would be a mechanism to kick a little of it back my way.

“Ya, that idea is dildos.” Skwisgaar Skwigelf
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