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Daugrin
Forum Full Member


Registered: 03/24/09
Posts: 1172
Location: , Extraverse
 
Ed Gets Suited Again
Sunday, July 22 2018 @ 12:04 PM CDT



Rickie B demonstrates Marvin Gaye's "Let's Get It On" in detail vs Ed's obvious rip of the tune.
In the past melody, lyrics and arrangement were argued in court. Ed stole style.

Rick demonstrates, as in the "Blurred Lines" case btw, copy write protection has evolved under the law to cover style. Style might be hard to define? Naw. If it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, walks like a duck and swims like a duck- it is a duck.

Back when you needed a band that could play anything, style was not protected, every band was unique. Specifically this in large part had to do with drumming. Drummers all sound different. Not so much other instrumentalists. Here's how the creative process use to work for many bands. Work up an arrangement of say a Sam Cook tune. Bring in the singer. Allow the singing talent to develop a response to the material. Instant stuff to play in the middle of a set at the local divorcee bar.

Fast forward to our current situation. Now bands? (There are few, cos there 'aint no money in it.) Much music now is created by Loners who pound out covers of popular songs on keyboards, or simply utilize loops to rip the rhythm section of popular tunes and steal the grooves for repackaging with a curt body commercial, and or mass media consumer messaging.

Drumming, on commercial recordings, is no longer as diverse as it once was... it's now basically machine oriented. When the singing talent, as in our example of the creative process above, hits the tune- they recognize the obvious rip, where once the adept band could fool them, and, the muse no longer is present. Doesn't everything sounds like a remake of something?

Ed creates novel things? He brings new material to old songs and brings forth something unique, eclipsing the inspirational material? Ed's lawyer is going to argue this very point at the trial.

Ed, (standing in here for the modern music industry standard), slavishly reproduces something and sings over it, dressing it in contemporary culture and with access to the Big Music world, (which you or I can never afford), makes pop hits. This, in my opinion, is why style is now being protected. Ed is gonna loose in court and style is the hottest component in music today, for only the approved will do for between your ears!

Stream some weird eclectic piece off the net today and give these industry folks another slap...

BTW support Rick online. He has stepped up for the free music community, his free content is informative and his opinions usually make much sense, even when he is making fun...

Daug
MikeRobinson
Forum Full Member


Registered: 08/29/11
Posts: 848
Location: Chattanooga, TN United States
 
Re:Ed Gets Suited Again
Monday, July 23 2018 @ 01:54 PM CDT

In US patent law, there is the fundamental precept that “you cannot patent an idea.”   Only a particular, concrete, manifestation.   I’m not sure that a nebulous idea of claiming proprietary interest in a “style” will actually make it all the way through the US Supreme Court, assuming that the parties have enough money to take it that far . . .

So, maybe the best thing to do is to just give Mr. Gaye some (more) money, without admitting anything, and go back to making music.   Just let someone else set the ground-shattering new legal precedent, if there be any.
Daugrin
Forum Full Member


Registered: 03/24/09
Posts: 1172
Location: , Extraverse
 
Re:Ed Gets Suited Again
Monday, July 23 2018 @ 09:33 PM CDT

Quote by: MikeRobinson
In US patent law, there is the fundamental precept that “you cannot patent an idea.”   Only a particular, concrete, manifestation.   I’m not sure that a nebulous idea of claiming proprietary interest in a “style” will actually make it all the way through the US Supreme Court, assuming that the parties have enough money to take it that far . . .

So, maybe the best thing to do is to just give Mr. Gaye some (more) money, without admitting anything, and go back to making music.   Just let someone else set the ground-shattering new legal precedent, if there be any.



I agree. The best thing for Ed and his team to do is pay the holders of the copy write on the song. The issue is they started at $100,000,000. No one can afford to get involved with that kinda start money.
Now an interesting point might be to argue that style is a function of arrangement, Arrangements can be copy written. This is why I am certain Ed can not win. There is not sufficient deviation in the arrangement on Ed's tune. He ripped the verse section completely, as Rick demonstrates. He's added material, but I don't see him prevailing against the original copy write holder.

Daug
 
bronco
Forum Full Member


Registered: 05/31/04
Posts: 581
Location: N/A
 
Re:Ed Gets Suited Again
Wednesday, July 25 2018 @ 11:47 AM CDT

This whole thing kind of blows my mind. I certainly didn't hear Marvin Gaye when listening to Ed's song. But there it is. Wild! One of the things I truly wanted when I started to hit my peak as a songwriter was to create totally original songs, with different chord progressions, melodies and lyric subject. Well I may have met that criteria with four or five out of several hundred but you soon begin to see what others have suggested. With only so many chords and notes it is inevitable that you start duplicating what has already been done. Of course you put your own stamp on everything via your voice, melody and phrasing but chord progressions and style are duplicated. Not intentionally, just from having listened to so much of other people's music. I personally believe that you can't copyright a chord progression or a drum style. Only if you could prove that the artist intentionally stole those rather than just have his subconscious at work.