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J.A.Stewart
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Registered: 11/13/04
Posts: 4609
Location: Somewhere In Time, USA
 
Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Monday, June 04 2018 @ 10:25 PM CDT



MY LATEST: A demo version of my Work-In-Progress DAILY GRIND
MikeRobinson
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Registered: 08/29/11
Posts: 848
Location: Chattanooga, TN United States
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Tuesday, June 05 2018 @ 08:39 AM CDT

One important trick that I have used to good effect is to fade-out the different tracks, or track groups, not all-at-once but rather at different rates.   All of them fade out, starting at the same time, but at different rates so that (say ...) the midrange goes first, then the highs, then the lows including the drums.   You can mimic the Doppler effect and the feeling that the song is receding into the distance.   (This is also the principle of the fog-horn, which is always a deep note because low frequencies are more energetic and travel farther.)  

You can also “foreshadow” the coming fade-out by starting one of the fades – very slightly, at first – a second or two before the fade sequence begins.   A prominent track begins to become less-prominent a few seconds earlier.   The song begins to feel that it is “thinning out” just before the fade begins.
SmokeyVW
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Registered: 06/13/06
Posts: 7149
Location: N/A
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Wednesday, June 06 2018 @ 01:41 PM CDT

EDIT: guess i should have listened to the video first. nah. screw it

i have often thought that fade outs were cop outs

and then other times i thought they made lots of artistic sense

it's really hard to solidly close out a song. the goal of many songs is to create a groove that feels like it could go on forever, and now you need to find a way to end it. arrg. sometimes all it takes to substitute one chord that leads to a clean ending. often a V-I

but if it's not done well, it sounds very artificial. like the timer ran out, and it's time to stop now

i think a possible plus side of fade outs is that it leaves the song in the listener's head, which helps create the "ear worm effect" - which for commercial songs is a real goal

but artistically it also has a very legit artistic purpose. if your song it trying to express an idea of something that will go on indefinitely, the fade out works quite well!

go figure
SmokeyVW
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Registered: 06/13/06
Posts: 7149
Location: N/A
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Wednesday, June 06 2018 @ 03:02 PM CDT

one more comment

fade outs invite creative cross fades from one song to the next on a radio show

that ain't happening any more
VicDiesel
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Registered: 02/14/06
Posts: 3017
Location: Austin, TX
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Wednesday, June 06 2018 @ 10:42 PM CDT

Quote by: MikeRobinson
One important trick



Somewhere deep in the fade-out, introduce some variation. On some track of Toto IV Jeff Porcaro is doing some brilliant counter-rhythms, when the sound is almost gone.

Victor.

-- My CD.
Sigmund
Forum Full Member


Registered: 12/31/08
Posts: 412
Location: San Diego, California United States
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Tuesday, June 12 2018 @ 01:57 PM CDT

I've received criticism for them in the past by other macjammers, and I do think there is this school of thought out there with some that fade outs are sort of a lazy way to finish a tune, and I couldn't disagree more.

I've always considered the fade out to be an artistic choice, and consequently a lot of my music ends with fade outs. Many times, because I'm a guitar player, I'll solo until the end as the song fades - looking over my playlist I find that is a frequent choice for me - but not always. I've created fade outs similar to what Mike talks about, with different instruments or sections fading at different intervals, until by the end of the fade only one instrument remains.

One of my personal favorite fade outs was in my song "Moon Called Mars", where I play a guitar solo in the final section into a fade out - that actually fades into a final string movement that then ends without fading out.

Thanks to you, Mr. Stewart, for the interesting topic of conversation - frankly a refreshing break from the political rhetoric that seems to endlessly drone on and on in our forums these days...


MikeRobinson
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Registered: 08/29/11
Posts: 848
Location: Chattanooga, TN United States
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Thursday, June 14 2018 @ 08:23 PM CDT

I definitely agree that a well-done fade can be an artistic element in the right hands.   It enables the artist to “pare down” the wall-of-noise with which he has until that point been confronted, and to do so in precisely the sequence selected by the artist, systematically focusing the listener’s attention, ultimately, to the one track that is the last man standing.

Not to suggest that this has any relevance at all, but I applied the same technique in my Young Men, White Gloves track to purposely add emphasis to the two things left-standing:   the trumpet (playing what you now recognize to be Taps), and two defiant drum-strikes.   I did it so that you might feel that the entire song came down to those two strikes – and to whatever two-word gesture of defiance you might wish to superimpose over them.
KCsGROOVE
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Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 123
Location: , Netherlands
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Wednesday, June 20 2018 @ 12:40 PM CDT

fade out....... and then the reprise :-)

every note counts
alias
Forum Newbie


Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 6
Location: N/A
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Sunday, June 24 2018 @ 01:41 PM CDT

thoughtful fading v. fading as copout
i'm stuck on it being called an 'anti ending' ..now that could become an intriguing idea

life is but a meme
 
SmokeyVW
Forum Full Member


Registered: 06/13/06
Posts: 7149
Location: N/A
 
Re:Are Fade-Outs Fading Away?
Sunday, June 24 2018 @ 06:23 PM CDT

some people die suddenly and spectacularly.

others just sort of fade away.

there you go